General tactics.

[Stunke]

Now, some time sooner or later there will be a post for nasty tactics concerning each separate army faction, what I'd like to do, is make a tacticum generalis because these things say a lot about the feel of an entire game.
Newbies and curious guests alike would benefit from reading these tactics because if any of them is visiting this site, curious whether this is a game they would like to play, as opposed to just paint the rocking cool minies ofc, they would quickly get a glimpse of how things function, and just how deadly this game is.

I'll be playing my first game with the new rules tomorrow (on my birthday thank you) demoing for some ten to twenty people in the local game store, so i'll post a battle report by then.

So without further ado I'll post up the first couple of things that I noticed going through the rulebook.

1) Living screens are not as effective as they are in other games. Size differences make it possible to aim for ANY unit within LOS. You will have to group your leaders in with the units to hide them from the enemy.

2) AoE weapons seem to have become very efficient. Especially ST templates.
You choose the PoI, instead of having to adhere to hard and fast rules, thereby making the most of your shots.You always get the +3 on your AS no matter what you're firing at (besides range mods), but the scatter rules make large templates very likely to hit part of their mark anyway. You place templates instead of aiming at individuals, ignoring cover. Makes sense and makes templates a new tactical consideration. There is no maybe/maybe-not hit by a template blast. If you're even the slightest bit touched by the template youre hit.
Nice, fast, realistic!

3) Assasin units like "crack shots", AoE weapons and "infiltrators" are very valuable since killing the leader of a unit is a totally crippling move.
Go for the leader...always!

4) Initiative means everything. Things die quickly, so the real trick is to get the jump on your enemy... all the time.

5) Strength is in numbers. Close combat is very decisive, and numbers are even more so. Ganging up will kill anyone eventually!

6) Panic will tear your army apart, so any kind of creative composition of units will help reduce the number of panic tests you will have to roll.
Units with three or five members will have to take two or three casualties respectively before taking tests, units with four or six members will have to take as many casualties before testing for panic, but should the latter units fail, you will lose more points to a failed test than with the former.

7) Power multipliers work wonders... End of story!

[DA_MrSota]

Well done....couple of notes




1) Living screens are not as effective as they are in other games. Size differences make it possible to aim for ANY unit within LOS. You will have to group your leaders in with the units to hide them from the enemy.


Pg 31 Firing Over Units
To make a Ranged Assault over another Unit, the intervening
Unit must be a Size smaller than either the Unit attempting the
Ranged Assault, or the target Unit.

Most leaders are the same size as the other units in the squad

[i]If any part of the target Unit
is obscured in this way a Cover penalty applies to the attack
attempt (see

[Stunke]

I was thinking og trueborn and Murtros when i noted that the screens lost some of their potential.
Blast weapons will partly ignore this though.

Most leaders are the same size as the other units in the squad.
Thats where flamethrowers, grenades and other templates come in.


Flamethrowers mmmmmmmm :twisted:

[Kyle]

Meat shields are a must for the Skarrd! (They also make for great victory parties, yum)

One big thing in DA is that the order in which individual minis in a squad move is very important. I have found that people want to have a figure in a squad that is already based with the enemy move first. This is a mistake as the based figure will not get a gang up bonus. Also as the based figure is likly ahead of the rest of his squad, if whe based enemy is killed before he gets to go, he can be used to penetrate further into the enemy ranks!

Another big thing is that players tend to want to react immediately and attack a unit that just attacked them. But the unit that just attacked them will not be a threat again until the next turn. I learned the hard way that you have to use units before you loose them!

[Cain]

Hey Kyle,

You said...


Another big thing players tend to want to react immediately and attack a unit that just attacked them. But the unit that just attacked them will not be a threat again until the next turn. I learned the hard way that you have to use units before you loose them!

Could you expand on this a little... :? Not sure that I am following you train of thought. I want to use my units to their max effectiveness, so when you stated the above, it really caugt my attention...

[Stunke]

replace the word "base" with "in base to base contact"

The idea is to move all the members of a unit into close combat before activating those already in base to base at the beginning of your turn. That way they get to spend all their AP hacking away at an opponent with the gang up bonus, OR they get to charge on through the maimed enemy unit.

And instead of venting your pent up anger at the unit that just slaughtered half of yours, shoot them up, before engaging them i close combat, you ought to have a lot of units to activate before the enemy unit gets a second turn.

Makes sense?

[Pugwhan]

Think of it this way

Figures A B C are part of a unit

Figure A is in Base to Base contact with Enemy figure Z

Instead of Activating in order (A B C)

Activate C and charge into contact. Now C gets the charge bonus<for the first round> and friends in combat bonus. If doesn't kill then Charge with B, he's getting Charge bonus <for the first round> and 2 friends in combat bonuses. Now if he doesn't kill then activate A. he won't get a charge bonus <already in combat> but he gets 2 friends in combat bonuses. This is the best way to have a group of Banes take down trueborn. Yes, I'm a forsaken player. Also in the example if the target was killed before A got his action then he is now free to charge someone else and will most likely be close to the actioin.

One major thing to note is that a figure has to use all its actions before activating another figure. This means you can't have C charge, then B Charge, and then go back to C to get the big gang up bonus.


The other point that Kyle was making is that a unit that has already been activated against you isn't as big of a threat as one that hasn't been activated yet. So try to nail units that haven't activated in a round before hitting the ones that have.

[Kyle]

Well Cain, I think Pugwhan and Stunke pretty much covered it.

[Shinobi]

Now if he doesn't kill then activate A. he won't get a charge bonus <already in combat> but he gets 3 friends in combat bonuses.

Errr, shouldn't A (in this example) only get 2 friends in combat bonuses? Coz he didn't charge in, there are only the same number of combatants there when he activates.

[Stunke]

Thats how I count up gang-up bonuses anyway.

[Pugwhan]

Now if he doesn't kill then activate A. he won't get a charge bonus <already in combat> but he gets 3 friends in combat bonuses.

Errr, shouldn't A (in this example) only get 2 friends in combat bonuses? Coz he didn't charge in, there are only the same number of combatants there when he activates.


Dang thats what I get working on a post at work and having to deal with customers. Your right.. It would only be 2 friends in combat. I edited the original post. Good catch.

[gunslinger]

there is really no real way to sum up tactics on one post.. being flexible, adapting, best vs worse.. etc etc etc.. Dark AGe is not a game where you can try to min/max armies to exploit your opponent. we do that on purpose in play testing.. we break it so you don't have to..

on one hand, if you are just doing nuts and bolts numbers comparisons you have just killed the fun of the game, it becomes a program at that point..

now, taking leaders out is beneficial, but to a good opponent, good luck getting there...

[Stunke]

Dark Age is not a game where you can try to min/max armies to exploit your opponent. we do that on purpose in play testing.. we break it so you don't have to..

on one hand, if you are just doing nuts and bolts numbers comparisons you have just killed the fun of the game, it becomes a program at that point..

now, taking leaders out is beneficial, but to a good opponent, good luck getting there...

Many times have I praised the game for the tactical flexibility, keeping this game from ending up like WHFB, so I am not sure as to why you mention it. But in any case, if new players should ever read this post, its a good thing to make sure is pointed out somewhere.

Now there is not much secret to the fact that I am into wargames for the maths and tactics of it. :roll:

IMO I am not turning this into a program, I am challenging my ananlytic sense to see if I can manage to see "through" the words in a rulebook, and execute things as I imagine them. Its a matter of personal satisfaction
And as I have already pointed out, I really like this game for the complexity of it.
I managed to see through the WHFB and 40K rules in no time, and thats one of the things that I dont like about the GW games.
You're right in the sense that one could possibly take the fun out of a game, but since my mind works in strict mathematical/statistical terms I am unable to turn this off, and so it is imortant for me to find and play games that have very simple rules, and endless possibilities.

And here I am!

On the subject of hiding and keeping leaders alive.
Give some tactics, reflectins, advice, info pro/cons, anything. This is a general tectics thread after all, share your experiences with the rest of the community. :D

[Pyrrhus]

IMO I am not turning this into a program, I am challenging my ananlytic sense ...

Agree with you 100% Its entertaining and chalenging to break down the odds in your head and test your theory on the board. You're using dice though, so the random factor is always there . . . bit like gambling.

And as for taking the fun out of it . . . Does a musician enjoy a song less because he can identify the chords being played? No. He just appreciates it on a different level than other people.

[gunslinger]

[quote]

And as for taking the fun out of it . . . Does a musician enjoy a song less because he can identify the chords being played? No. He just appreciates it on a different level than other people.

i don't agree at all.. but then i am big enough to say that i will just agree to disagree with you and call it a day.. (yes, i spent about an hour on a response that involved musical explanation and all that, but by the time I got done with it, i was bored of it.. so i will leave it at this.. apples =/= oranges.. nuf said